Salam Fatima,

I really appreciate the fact that you value my reply which included slight analysis, this shows how capable you are of carrying an intelligent discussion backed up with references and so. I’m really enjoying this, also I am very sure that this would end with both of us learning new things about Islam :)

As far as I know there are Al-Sihah Al Sitta, which are the six major collections of hadith yet the two Sahih’s that are mainly referred to (hence their title “Sahih” – of their authenticity) are Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim. Therefore, and I beg to be excused for that but I don’t consider Musnad Ahmad an authentic source for hadith.

I will definitely look into getting “Evolution of Fiqh” – seems really interesting. Thanks a lot. And I too apologise from Roba if we are going off topic here.

About the soul: it does leave upon death, but it’s returned again to the body. This is mentioned in a saheeh hadith in Musnad Ahmed. There is also an actual hadith narration that mentions a sahabi who was kidnapped by a jinn that is narrated by al-Bayhaqi — this hadith is also saheeh.

Also, I agree about ijtihaad being important, but I think it has its time and place, and I would encourage you to read up some more about it. If you’re interested, I would recommend the book, “Evolution of Fiqh” by Bilal Phillips as it deals with difference of opinion among scholars, interpretations of evidence, how fiqh has changed over time, etc.

Roba, I apologize for intruding, especially with a topic that you cannot regard with any seriousness.

that is a verse from the quran …

i rest my case.

further reading …
http://alkabarit.com/roqia/alhassad.htm

http://www.islamadvice.com/sulook/sulook5.htm

http://www.alshamsi.net/islam/do3a/7assad.html

http://www.islamonline.net/arabic/In_Depth/Magic/Topic_03.shtml

Thanks for supplying these references regarding Jinn and Punishment of the Grave. Yet when I read it, the Quranic verse referenced was the following

“Those who eat Ribaa [usury] will not stand (on the Day of Resurrection) except like the standing of a person beaten by Shaytaan (Satan) leading him to insanity”

The Hadith mentions that “The shaytaan flows through the son of Adam like blood.” “أن الشيطان يجري من بني آدم مجرى الدم”

I’m a strong believer in Ijtihaad: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ijtihad
and I think at the end of the day, if you’re confused about something, it comes to the individual’s interpretation of the Quran or the Hadith. And therefore, I don’t think I would interpret what’s been mentioned as a solid proof to the fact that Jinn can actually possess a human being.

In Arabic, especially in the older times, people used to be very articulate and that includes Prophet Muhammad (PBUH). This could strongly be a figure of speech that he uses to warn Muslims that Shaytaan can be wherever you are, and possibly induce you to do wrong constantly.

Also in the Quranic verse, I have to go back to the Arabic one to see it could possibly sound different. Although the one above doesn’t fully provide enough evidence on possession, as it says “..Shaytaan leading him to insanity”.

I came to this realisation after I saw a talk show on JordanTV last year, where they had a number of Islamic scholars and there were a number of them which strongly denied the validity of Jinn’s possession to human beings, and blamed it on the society’s influence on people with mental illnesses making them to actually believe that they’re possessed rather than having a severe case of Schizophrenia or another.

Regarding “Athaab al Qabr”, the proof given from the Quran is not that solid.
“وما انتَ بِمسمعٍ مَّن في القُبور” this simply translates into “you cannot hear those who are in graves”. This and other verses don’t seem to explicitly mention Athaab al Qabr. I might be standing corrected regarding the Hadith, but I’m absolutely against those Urban Legends and stories people come up with regarding snakes crushing the bodies bones, or man dugged out to be found in flames and other ones. Cause I’m far as I’m concerned, the soul leaves the body by death, no?

I hope I made my point clear, and again thanks for the links. I found a couple but unfortunately they’re all in Arabic. Salaam :)

The point is this is our culture, our beleifs, and in a clear word “our religion”
Why when it come to this feild we always try to rational or explain the issue?

Ok do you believe in ANGELS?? in KARAKORZIA they dont however in NORTH POLE they do, and there is a man called JOHAN AHMAD GORGE who says that he actually sees one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My point is, mayeb thee is something BEYOND our LIMITED minds that is really Devils Eye,, we may feel it in some cases,, so times we refer it to LUCK others we Refer it to Devils Eye. in our Reigion the call “LUCK” “Gods Will” and they call bad things that happens to you when others envy you for as “Devils Eye” as simple as this. and yes both exists!

And if you do not see it or can not explain it that does not mean that it DOES not EXIST, or then lets Debate and Argue “Where is your SOUL??”