Comments on: The Face of Mohammad http://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/ Another Casualty to the Seduction Of Art Wed, 08 Feb 2012 16:00:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: erikhttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-677 erik Sat, 04 Feb 2006 01:09:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-677 I am sorry for the last post Roba,I am just a little upset right now. We give away 1.4 billion dollars in foreign aid. Of those we give 10 million dollars in Palestine, we estabilsh projects to raise the standard of living. We build homes for families, we try to help them get a government and a state, we condemm Israel for what they do and what happens ?They burn our flag!! They tell us to go home because some independent newspaper prints a drawing..I just don't get it...With kind regardsErik I am sorry for the last post Roba,

I am just a little upset right now. We give away 1.4 billion dollars in foreign aid. Of those we give 10 million dollars in Palestine, we estabilsh projects to raise the standard of living. We build homes for families, we try to help them get a government and a state, we condemm Israel for what they do and what happens ?

They burn our flag!!
They tell us to go home because some independent newspaper prints a drawing..

I just don’t get it…

With kind regards

Erik

]]> By: Robahttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-678 Roba Sat, 04 Feb 2006 01:09:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-678 Eric, please understand that I am very much against these boycotts and the reaction. I assure you that I find flag burning not condonable at all, regardless of circumstances- neither are death threats. Eric, please understand that I am very much against these boycotts and the reaction. I assure you that I find flag burning not condonable at all, regardless of circumstances- neither are death threats.

]]> By: erikhttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-676 erik Fri, 03 Feb 2006 16:04:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-676 The legend goes:"June 15 1219 during a battle between the danes and the estonians at a place called Felin, the danes were almost defeated and humbly called upon help from God. A flag fell down from the sky, a red cloth with the christian cross upon it. The danes gathered hope and finally won the battle."So when burning the danish flag, people are actually burning the christian holy cross!A thing I have read muslims would never do.Or would they ?RegardsErik - Denmark The legend goes:

“June 15 1219 during a battle between the danes and the estonians at a place called Felin, the danes were almost defeated and humbly called upon help from God.
A flag fell down from the sky, a red cloth with the christian cross upon it. The danes gathered hope and finally won the battle.”

So when burning the danish flag, people are actually burning the christian holy cross!

A thing I have read muslims would never do.

Or would they ?

Regards

Erik – Denmark

]]> By: Robahttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-675 Roba Fri, 03 Feb 2006 06:34:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-675 Dearest Ibn Yafa, I will not sit and argue with you or prove any points, have you no understanding for simple layouts? When I was refering to the influence, I was refering to it as Islamic art in bulk, and not as Turkish, Persian, or Indian paintings. Secondly, I was very much refering to the Chinese influence in these paintings, rather than Turkish, Persian, or Indian, and it is unfortunate that your eyes cannot percieve that distinct influence. I recommend you read a book called "The Arab Influence on Islamic Art" by Wijdan Ali, it will surely enlighten your eyes and mind. Dearest Ibn Yafa, I will not sit and argue with you or prove any points, have you no understanding for simple layouts? When I was refering to the influence, I was refering to it as Islamic art in bulk, and not as Turkish, Persian, or Indian paintings. Secondly, I was very much refering to the Chinese influence in these paintings, rather than Turkish, Persian, or Indian, and it is unfortunate that your eyes cannot percieve that distinct influence.
I recommend you read a book called “The Arab Influence on Islamic Art” by Wijdan Ali, it will surely enlighten your eyes and mind.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-674 Anonymous Fri, 03 Feb 2006 01:15:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-674 Blog by Anonymous at 5 05 PM 2nd Feb 06 says it all.If 'they' made anything id boycott it. The sooner we use up all their oil and sod them off the better for us all. They can go back to eating rats and camels in the desert and play their games with each other without bothering us!Technology will soon make 'them' and their 'sacred religion' redundant to the rest of the sane world. Can’t wait for that day then we can stop pandering to their whinges and whims. Blog by Anonymous at 5 05 PM 2nd Feb 06 says it all.

If ‘they’ made anything id boycott it. The sooner we use up all their oil and sod them off the better for us all. They can go back to eating rats and camels in the desert and play their games with each other without bothering us!

Technology will soon make ‘them’ and their ‘sacred religion’ redundant to the rest of the sane world.
Can’t wait for that day then we can stop pandering to their whinges and whims.

]]> By: ibn yafahttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-673 ibn yafa Thu, 02 Feb 2006 20:41:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-673 Roba...I salute your modernity, liberalism and intelligence. Your ingenious comment on how Turkish, Persian and Indian paintings are marked by 'heavy eastern influence', pretty much says everything about you.More posts please. This is far too entertaining. Roba…I salute your modernity, liberalism and intelligence. Your ingenious comment on how Turkish, Persian and Indian paintings are marked by ‘heavy eastern influence’, pretty much says everything about you.

More posts please. This is far too entertaining.

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-672 Anonymous Thu, 02 Feb 2006 17:04:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-672 I just would like to say that it seem like the ocidental world is about to disappear under the pressure of middle east; I dont understand all this fuz about some paitings. Muslims say to respect their religion, i say respect first of all us, europeans, christians. I have nothing against Muslims, the coran and the religion itself as long as it remains as personal choise and as along as everyone has their freedom;I laugh when you, people talk about respect. First of all just look at the way you keep mocking our religion, look at your behavior when calling european women whores and saying that we all will be burning in hell because we dont respect the coran rules. Is this your tolerance? Throughout the humain existence there have always been different parodies and ironic paintings of different characters even kings. How many times i saw the perverted paiting of Jesus, no one made a big deal. Because we dont live under Staline's regime when people would be executed for such thing, that what we were fighting; Why is that muslims use every signle reason to get into conflict? Dont you have anything better to do? While living in Europe i get named a whore for wearing a skirt, you dont see me yelling at all corners that i'm himiliated; I just have to ignore them and keep existing, why do muslims use evey chance to show their hostility to the western world; I know many great muslims who's religion doest not involve in their coexistence with the rest of the world, i'd call all those who created this conflict the islamists, the fanatics who would just keep dreaming about war; I am a free person and as long as i dont hurt anyone physically, as long as i stay the law-abiding citizen, i have a freedom of speech and it wont have any boundaries. It is revolting to realize that we are being under enormous pressure from the muslims communities in european countries; Our homeland is not our anymore, where we could feel safe. Where this whole agression comes from? How come no one was ever bothered by buhddists or orthodoxes? There have been also lots of ironic paintings, mocking those religions. I could say a lot more, but my point is clear I just would like to say that it seem like the ocidental world is about to disappear under the pressure of middle east;
I dont understand all this fuz about some paitings. Muslims say to respect their religion, i say respect first of all us, europeans, christians. I have nothing against Muslims, the coran and the religion itself as long as it remains as personal choise and as along as everyone has their freedom;I laugh when you, people talk about respect. First of all just look at the way you keep mocking our religion, look at your behavior when calling european women whores and saying that we all will be burning in hell because we dont respect the coran rules. Is this your tolerance? Throughout the humain existence there have always been different parodies and ironic paintings of different characters even kings. How many times i saw the perverted paiting of Jesus, no one made a big deal. Because we dont live under Staline’s regime when people would be executed for such thing, that what we were fighting; Why is that muslims use every signle reason to get into conflict? Dont you have anything better to do? While living in Europe i get named a whore for wearing a skirt, you dont see me yelling at all corners that i’m himiliated;
I just have to ignore them and keep existing, why do muslims use evey chance to show their hostility to the western world; I know many great muslims who’s religion doest not involve in their coexistence with the rest of the world, i’d call all those who created this conflict the islamists, the fanatics who would just keep dreaming about war;
I am a free person and as long as i dont hurt anyone physically, as long as i stay the law-abiding citizen, i have a freedom of speech and it wont have any boundaries. It is revolting to realize that we are being under enormous pressure from the muslims communities in european countries; Our homeland is not our anymore, where we could feel safe. Where this whole agression comes from? How come no one was ever bothered by buhddists or orthodoxes? There have been also lots of ironic paintings, mocking those religions.
I could say a lot more, but my point is clear

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-671 Anonymous Thu, 02 Feb 2006 13:48:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-671 Seems that its ok to burn National Flags of some countries, mainly Western, but we all seem ok with that. No world war 3 or vendetta or boycot of the country that it allows it. God (any one) help us if it was a Muslum (or other equally paranonia) state. I will stay anonymous in case anyone boycots me or worse! Seems that its ok to burn National Flags of some countries, mainly Western, but we all seem ok with that. No world war 3 or vendetta or boycot of the country that it allows it. God (any one) help us if it was a Muslum (or other equally paranonia) state. I will stay anonymous in case anyone boycots me or worse!

]]> By: Anonymoushttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-670 Anonymous Tue, 31 Jan 2006 21:29:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-670 Jesus is actually a CHARACTER in south park... which GOVERMENT objected to that? please, as arabs we should LIVE WITH THE TIMES. stop embarrassing us arabs abroad!!!!! Jesus is actually a CHARACTER in south park… which GOVERMENT objected to that? please, as arabs we should LIVE WITH THE TIMES. stop embarrassing us arabs abroad!!!!!

]]> By: some norwegianhttp://www.andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/comment-page-1/#comment-669 some norwegian Sun, 29 Jan 2006 20:18:00 +0000 http://andfaraway.net/blog/2006/01/26/the-face-of-mohammad/#comment-669 <I>"When Natasha told me about the Jordanian parliament's call for the punishment of the Danish cartoonist that drew 12 caricatures of the Prophet Mohammad I got quite upset. I'm still upset, and although I can't even begin to understand why they would do such a thing..."</I>While it's not clear to me who you have trouble understanding, I'm going to take it upon myself to explain the papers side of the story. A brief summary of the original article should accomplish that nicely.The infamous article started out commenting on the predicament of some writer, who was upset that he couldn't find anyone willing to illustrate his book on Muhammad for fear of having their throats slit by islamists. It went on to recount numerous death threats made by this group against various authors, publishers and filmmakers, as well as the Salman Rushdie related murder of a Norwegian publisher. Listing cases of translators and authors opting to stay anonymous for fear of islamist reprisals, it then went on to assert that islamist intimidation of public discourse, and the resulting self censorship, constituted a noteworthy threat to free speech. The paper finished up by noting that free expression is integral to the concept of liberal democracy, and appended the caricatures as if to re-assert the right in Danish society to express oneself freely, even at the expense of the religious sensitivities of others.tololy: <I>This is almost like potraying Jesus in an offensive state, some may like that, most will not, and some would go to extremes.</I>Caricatures of Jesus don’t routinely result in an avalanche of death threats.fida: <I>Needless to say, this so called "freedom of expression" does no good for Muslims, Christians or even atheists.</I>It does me a bundle of good, and I'm keeping it. No one is forcing you to listen.Mirror: <I>first of all i am athiest but i found what the danish cartoonists did way out of line . i agree on freedom of choice but freedom has limits. its been reported that the news papers that published the cartoons was trying to "sell out"...</I>There are limits to speech even in Denmark, fortunately offending religious sensibilities isn't overstepping them.Jameel said: <I>Roba, You want to test the freedom of speech in the west? Ridiculing Muslims is very easy, Shall we try something more challenging? Say something like Disputing the holocaust may be?</I>Yes, please do. I predict that if you do manage to convince someone to listen to you, you will be met first with ridicule, then with factual discourse, and that while people may well cast doubt upon your mental faculties, no one will challenge your right to express your opinion or your publishers right to publish it. You will meet neither censorship nor intimidation.<I>Do you remember what happened in Sweden a couple of years ago with one of the exhibits at an art museum? Where was the freedom of speech then? </I>You mean the thingamabob that was removed after the Israeli embassy launched a complaint? It was removed by the gallery, with no involvement of the government, and while I find the removal of it regrettable, it does not constitute censorship.roba: <I>I got upset when the Jordanian Christians banned the Da Vinci Code, I got upset when the Western Christians had piss fits at various advertisments that had Christ portrayed, and I got pissed when Burger King succumbed to the pressure and removed the cute logo of an icecream cone because some Ikhawanjeyeh decided it looked like the world Allah.</I>Ah, you're on my side then. I apologise for doubting you earlier. “When Natasha told me about the Jordanian parliament’s call for the punishment of the Danish cartoonist that drew 12 caricatures of the Prophet Mohammad I got quite upset. I’m still upset, and although I can’t even begin to understand why they would do such a thing…”

While it’s not clear to me who you have trouble understanding, I’m going to take it upon myself to explain the papers side of the story. A brief summary of the original article should accomplish that nicely.

The infamous article started out commenting on the predicament of some writer, who was upset that he couldn’t find anyone willing to illustrate his book on Muhammad for fear of having their throats slit by islamists. It went on to recount numerous death threats made by this group against various authors, publishers and filmmakers, as well as the Salman Rushdie related murder of a Norwegian publisher. Listing cases of translators and authors opting to stay anonymous for fear of islamist reprisals, it then went on to assert that islamist intimidation of public discourse, and the resulting self censorship, constituted a noteworthy threat to free speech. The paper finished up by noting that free expression is integral to the concept of liberal democracy, and appended the caricatures as if to re-assert the right in Danish society to express oneself freely, even at the expense of the religious sensitivities of others.

tololy:
This is almost like potraying Jesus in an offensive state, some may like that, most will not, and some would go to extremes.

Caricatures of Jesus don’t routinely result in an avalanche of death threats.

fida:
Needless to say, this so called “freedom of expression” does no good for Muslims, Christians or even atheists.

It does me a bundle of good, and I’m keeping it. No one is forcing you to listen.

Mirror:
first of all i am athiest but i found what the danish cartoonists did way out of line .
i agree on freedom of choice but freedom has limits.
its been reported that the news papers that published the cartoons was trying to “sell out”…

There are limits to speech even in Denmark, fortunately offending religious sensibilities isn’t overstepping them.

Jameel said:
Roba, You want to test the freedom of speech in the west? Ridiculing Muslims is very easy, Shall we try something more challenging? Say something like Disputing the holocaust may be?

Yes, please do. I predict that if you do manage to convince someone to listen to you, you will be met first with ridicule, then with factual discourse, and that while people may well cast doubt upon your mental faculties, no one will challenge your right to express your opinion or your publishers right to publish it. You will meet neither censorship nor intimidation.

Do you remember what happened in Sweden a couple of years ago with one of the exhibits at an art museum? Where was the freedom of speech then?

You mean the thingamabob that was removed after the Israeli embassy launched a complaint? It was removed by the gallery, with no involvement of the government, and while I find the removal of it regrettable, it does not constitute censorship.

roba:
I got upset when the Jordanian Christians banned the Da Vinci Code, I got upset when the Western Christians had piss fits at various advertisments that had Christ portrayed, and I got pissed when Burger King succumbed to the pressure and removed the cute logo of an icecream cone because some Ikhawanjeyeh decided it looked like the world Allah.

Ah, you’re on my side then. I apologise for doubting you earlier.

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